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Talk:Gayle Marsh (Arrowverse: Earth-38)
Two Psis (sigh) So, the Adventures of Supergirl tie-in comic had earlier introduced an adaptation of Psi. How do we handle this? Merger or separate pages? DrJohnnyDiablo (talk) 23:32, October 10, 2017 (UTC) :Has this aired yet? If not, let's at least wait a week. Kyletheobald (talk) 23:51, October 10, 2017 (UTC) It airs next week (October 16th to be exact). although the character has been confirmed by the creators as appearing and the teaser for next week confirms her appearance. So to keep the Wiki up-to-date and provide all the information we currently have about it is why I made the page. we can always go back in and update things when the episode airs next week. Lordofninjas1 (talk) 00:08, October 11, 2017 (UTC) also, @JohnnyDiablo, I forgot to add this into my original post, but I originally did try to do a kind of merger on the other Psi page with this character. what I mean is I tried updating the information and photo and whatever and also tried to add the episode appearance onto the "first appearance" section and clarify something to the effect of "its the same character, same earth, same everything kinda thing in both mediums but this is the first comic appearance and this is the first television appearance" (https://marvel.wikia.com/wiki/Barbara_Morse_(Earth-616), here is a better example of what I mean, where in the first appearances section it clarifies like "Astonishing Tales #6 (unnamed)", then below it it has "Astonishing Tales #12 (as Dr. Barbara Morse)" etc.) I was trying to get it to do something like that but I couldn't figure out how to without breaking the already pre-existing link, so I just stopped that and made a separate page so that the information is at least on here and can be merged or whatever at a later point. Lordofninjas1 (talk) 00:42, October 11, 2017 (UTC) : We don't address any information that hasn't been released yet. The picture you uploaded, as well as the page you created, are premature and should be done (correctly) next week. --- Haroldrocks talk 01:02, October 11, 2017 (UTC) not meaning to be rude or disrespectful or anything, but technically speaking this information has been released as the creators have released the information vocally and through interviews and such and we have visual release of information with the teaser trailer, however I will agree that we don't have all the information about it as of yet and that we will have all the information next week, but the information on the article now and whatever is information that has been released (again whether vocally by interviews and such with the creators or visually by the teaser trailer and such). Lordofninjas1 (talk) 01:08, October 11, 2017 (UTC) : We don't go off of information in previews. We use interviews with creators as sources, but not in place of episodes soon to be aired. This is a site wide thing, not just something specifically for shows. For example, with comics, websites usually get their hands on like a 5 page preview of an issue before it comes out, but we never use any of that information until the official release date. Part of the reason is because things change. Like the issue with there being two Psis. Will the episode address it? Will we end up with two Psis, or will one retcon the other? We don't really know, no matter what previews or interviews tell us, until the episode is released and official. --- Haroldrocks talk 01:21, October 11, 2017 (UTC) While I understand why you don't use the information from previews and stuff because things change and whatnot I also understand that if something from a teaser or an interview or whatever was to be incorrect it would be somewhat simple for someone to go in and delete or correct the incorrect information, I understand that some of that stuff may be linked to categories and whatnot but those also seem somewhat easy to go into and correct and stuff as well. I have gone in and done things like that in the past on other wikis as well (gone in and corrected incorrect information that was given from a previous trailer or interview or whatnot) and it didn't seem to cause a lot of problems or really any problems at all. I understand that this is meant to be similar to an encyclopedia, however, as you may know encyclopedias are always correcting themselves and releasing new information on at least a semi-regular basis and such, so I'm sure we are able to do the same here. If they do turn out to be the same character, thats fine just put in a simple merger request and get it merged, that doesn't seem too difficult, if they turn out to be 2 separate characters, then we can leave it split and just correct or add the information pertaining only to this one, that seems somewhat simple as well. like I said previously in this, I just did it so that we could be as up to date as possible, with the information that we have, but if something does change or whatever it would be somewhat simple to fix it, if that makes any sense. also, usually with trailers and such they tend to be pretty reliable (I do know there have been a couple instances of incorrectness, like Barry Allen appearing in the earlier Legends of Tomorrow Trailers and stuff, as well as in film trailers, like Amazing Spider-Man 2) but with these ones it is usually released a week before the episode airs, therefore it isn't likely that they would be able to change much (unless they just omit it entirely) because they wouldn't have the time to film the new scenes or whatever before the episode would be airing, and usually trailers are meant as a way for the creator to get you to go see it and such, so I doubt there would be much incorrectness with using trailers for episodes that close together and stuff. if you guys don't want to do the work of coming back and re-fixing these pages all the time and whatever when we get new information, I would be willing to come back and correct it and whatever if need be, I mean I am only 1 human so I wouldn't be able to do all of them all the time, but I could at least get the majority, but being up to date with the information makes the wiki better (like it does with encyclopedias, which this is similar to) and would at least seem to quell some problems or arguments about articles and things not being complete when they should be or whatever. It is only helpful and not really hurtful. also, like I said previously I do not mean to be rude or disrespectful when I say any of this, I know that I have a "habit" of saying things in certain ways that make people think I am angry or trying to be rude or whatever, I've gotten a little better about it, but I'm still working on fixing it so sometimes it slips through and I apologize if I did come across as rude or disrespectful in any way, and I also apologize for this comment being kinda long, I sometimes just do like a "stream of consciousness" thing or want to try and cover as many points as possible, and sometimes that ends up with a really long comment, so again, I apologize. Lordofninjas1 (talk) 01:56, October 11, 2017 (UTC) : You have nothing to apologize for, don't worry, we're just having a discussion. I can understand your desire to keep the wiki up to date as much as possible, but the difference here is in our views on the phrase "up to date". Like I said, we usually consider official release dates as "up to date" information. I don't think there's much use trying to persuade you on our view as it is convincing us to switch to yours. It just important to emphasize that, this is site policy not to use previews or teasers before official release dates and, even if you don't prefer it or necessarily like the rule, that you respect it in order to keep consistencies site-wide. You can start a discussion page on the issue if you like, but I stand with the rules that are in place. : Also, on a sorta separate point, we've moved away from the (Supergirl TV Series) universe tag in favor of (Arrowverse: Earth-38). This page wouldn't be able to stay at its current position even if it wasn't early. Tying back to my first reply about waiting, we'd prefer to make the page AFTER we know what it should be named according to the official episode - Psi II (Arrowverse: Earth-38), Psi (Arrowverse: Earth-38), Tina Tinkletooter (Arrowverse: Earth-38), whatever the case may be. --- Haroldrocks talk 03:06, October 11, 2017 (UTC) I understand that official releases are "up to date" I have no issue with that, however, I guess the point I'm trying to make, is that maybe up to date should (and usually tends to in most other situations) mean the most recent information we have on it, whether official release or not. As I said previously if in the process of doing that something is found to be wrong or needing to be retconned simply come to the page and correct the wrong or retcon what needs retconning. Basically what I'm trying to say is I see where you are coming from with this, but you should also try and see it from my side, basically it's possible to do both, put up information as we get it, which would be my contribution to the compromise, and you would still get the information from the official release in there when it becomes available, in other words we both win. I'll leave that there as I too agree that there isn't much use to just trying to persuade to one side or the other, so trying to find a happy medium would be the next best thing. I understand that it's site policy not to use those but at the same time it ties your hands from being able to be a better site and having more users and such due to the most up to date info and stuff like that, it's not that I don't like the rule persay, more of a "if this rule were to be changed it would be more beneficial but if not then that's fine" type of feeling, if that makes any sense. I respect whatever decision is ultimately made and whatever, I'm just trying to give you guys something that would be of a benefit to you. As for a discussion page on it, yeah I don't think I would really want to, especially when trying similar things on other wikis and either it not being seen at all, or its just a string of admins or whatever saying "this is the rule and stuff" in so many words over and over again and not really working towards a compromise or anything really beneficial to the discussion, among other things, if that makes any sense. I also realize that the site has moved away from the (Supergirl TV Series) tag in favor of the (Arrowverse: Earth-38) tag, I have no issue with that, I just simply used the (Supergirl TV Series) tag to differentiate it from the other one for the time being, to make it less confusing like "they are the same universe and whatever but this is the comics one and this is the show one" type thing, I did originally try a merger with it (see one of my above posts for clarification) so that at least this wouldn't even be an issue to begin with, but I kept breaking links and stuff on the page and so I just gave up on that part and whatever, and its also just the first one that came to mind that made sense to differentiate it, I have no issue with it being changed or whatever. while I understand the reasoning behind waiting till after the official release to create and name pages and such, changing names and stuff on articles on here isn't difficult so it would just be a simple "oh, this name turned out to be incorrect somehow, ok lets take literally like a couple seconds to go in and change the name really quick cause its easy and a quick thing to do" type of situation. basically, its still correct, its just that it might not be as correct when the official release is out, and again it would prevent people from "vandalizing" the site to get the info on it, put the site the most up to date it could possibly be at the time, thus attracting more users, making it more beneficial and easy for those users to know all of what's going on and stuff and yeah. so if it does turn out to need to be Psi II (Arrowverse: Earth-38) it only takes a couple seconds at most to click the edit button, click the little pencil by the name, put in the new name, click enter or done or whatever, and publish the new update, its easy and it doesn't take much time. Lordofninjas1 (talk) 03:50, October 11, 2017 (UTC) * So, I take it that we can now definitively say that Psi (Arrowverse: Earth-38) and Gayle Marsh (Arrowverse: Earth-38) are different characters? I haven't yet seen the episode as it hasn't aired in the UK yet but from what the article says there's no mention of Gayle being a former employee of Fort Rozz, the two are are of different species (Kryptonian, human), have different abilities (dream manipulation vs fear projection and telekenesis), different real names (Psi vs Gayle Marsh), different hair colour, different eye colour, and Gayle (probably) has a physical body rather than being limited to people's dream worlds like Psi. So, is there need for the message "mark with a potential merger request for merging with Psi (Arrowverse:Earth-38), as it is unable to determine whether they are two seperate characters or one in the same" on the top of Gayle's article? With that said, were the events of the comics addressed in the episode? Ohdear15 (talk) 16:50, October 17, 2017 (UTC)